Wanted: Info on Shaolin Do Karate

Wow. That is a lot !

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“	Originally Posted By: BentMonk True. Good one. lol Intro? The one and only BentMonk needs no intro. lol Not yet, but I'll get around to it.	”

The mods would really prefer you doing that.

“	Originally Posted By: Ben Grimm I had a look at the SD Curriculum. You've got a lot of work to master and retain this in 2 years. No offence to you SD guys, but it just seems ridiculous to try to cram so muck knowledge in a small space of time. 1st Degree Black Belt to 2nd Degree Black Belt Tai Chi Ch'uan Yang Tai Chi (64) Pa Kua Chang Classical Pa Kua He Foo Chon Sin Black Tiger Claws the Heart He Foo Chuan Sen Black Tiger Turns the Body He Foo Huan Sen Black Tiger Flips the Body He Foo Shou Sang Wounded Black Tiger Foong Wang Chue Han Chien Crazy Mad Drunk Tang Lang Tse Ju Praying Mantis Enters the Door Chway Kai Drunken Begger Chway Tao Drunken Broadsword Chiang Su Lian Si Spear Fighting Tech. Luo Chia Chiang Luo Family Spear May Hua Chiang May Flower Spear Yang Chia Chiang Yang Family Spear Se Mien Pa Huan Saung Tao Oo 4 Face 8 Dir. Broadsword Tien Ta Suang Hu Tou Kou Double Tiger Hook Swords Shake Heaven Yen Tse Tien Hsia Tao Swallow Sweeps Down from Heaven U Si Sen Hua 5 Animal Live Training U Si Se Hua 5 Animal Dead Training U Si Nei Hua 5 Animal ShienTien Chi Training I Chin Ching Change Muscle & Tendon Especially with some of the Neigong exercises there. Anybody able to tell me what is 5 Animal Dead Training? Never heard of it before.	”

5 Animal Dead training...thats when you lie on the side of the road. and if in Iraq blow up.



All kidding aside yeah that's alot of stuff to cram in.

The tremendous amount of material available is both a strength and weakness of SD. As I understand it, the usual requirements for 2nd black are: Tai Chi 64, Tai Chi sword, the four Black Tiger forms, the four spear forms, Hsing I and Pa Qua. I believe the rest of that list is material that can be substituted for advancement if need be. I have not done any of the live/dead training yet, so I cannot comment on it.

I have been 1st black for about 10 years. I just finished learning Black Tiger Claws The Heart. At my school there is no real pressure to hurry through the ranks. You may learn at you own pace. Also, none of the forms I need to advance are seminars that I'll pay extra fees for. All I have to do is come to class and learn. I pay less than $100 a month for my daughter and I to attend classes. I can come to class 5 days a week if I like, no extra charge. I did buy patches for our uniforms and there are testing fees, but many other MAs have similar fees. I do not find the fees at our school to be excessive, nor are there any "hidden" fees I haven't mentioned.

I'm not a MA who is overly concerned with rank. I'm more concerned with being able to do what I know well. I'm working toward 2nd black simply because I needed a new MA goal. I'm happy to say I have accomplished the goals I had when I began my training, and needed something new to focus on.

There are many MA who are forms collectors. They're happy to learn the moves and move on to the next from. Then there are MA who prefer to look at each piece of material in depth, and learn as much as they can from it. Most MA IMO fall some where in between. SD caters to both.

“	Originally Posted By: Green_Horn 5 Animal Dead training...thats when you lie on the side of the road. and if in Iraq blow up. All kidding aside yeah that's alot of stuff to cram in.	”

Most styles require you know around 15 to 20 forms for black belt/sash. Shaolin Do's requirements are ludacris. How could one possibly remember all those forms for any length of time? Much less know and master over 600.

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Mark
Liberalism is a mental disorder. -M. Savage

As of this moment I have 25 forms committed to memory. I can demonstrate them, and teach them. I can explain the body mechanics and principles of movement within them. I am able to demonstrate and teach the martial applications of the movements. As I continue to learn new forms, I will not forget these.

For the sake of debate, let's say it took me 15 years to "master" these 25 forms. By this rationale, after 30 more years of training I will have "mastered" 75 forms. Some insist this is impossible. I'm a part time MA and full time career Dad to four kids, and yet I am doing it. The term "mastered" gets used a lot. I do not truly consider myself a "master" of anything, MA or otherwise. Everyone's definition of "master" is different. IMO most have never seen true mastery and even fewer would recognize it if they did...myself included.

Many teachers keep notes and diagrams of what they teach. I doubt GM Sin is any different. It is silly for anyone to expect him to be able to literally memorize 900 forms. I have seen GM Sin refer to what appeared to be very old hand written notes. If other teachers can do this, why criticize GM Sin?

In the style of Wing Chun I study, to get to my 1st Dan (or equivalent), I had to demonstrte the 3 empty headed forms with power, do a hell of a lot of Chi Sau, sparring, plus a written assignment explaining a technique or combination of my choice, and had to teach a beginner's class. For my 2nd Dan, I had to learn the Wooden Dummy in it's entirity, plus the previously mentioned forms, etc. Now I'm learning the 6 and a half staff form (Lit. translation, 6.5 stick). Our final form is the butterfly knife form. But I'm sure that in different lineages the grading structure is different.

It does seem like a lot of material to know and be able to demonstrate with any level of competence. I don't know or have not seen the vast majority of the forms listed above, does anyone have an idea how many moves each form has? If these are 5-10 move preset self-defense moves, that's not a huge list. If they are 40+ move forms, then.....

Well, the Tai Chi form has 64 movements in it, the rest I don't know. But maybe that will give some indication.

If I remember right Hua To Dead was a series of postures and breathing exersices. Part of the Qi Gong training.

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2. Absorb what is useful
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Ths is getting more and more interesting. Could you clarify more on this technique?

“	Originally Posted By: inufreak1 Sin the...never heard of that username.	”

It's not a user name. That's his name in real life. He is Grandmaster Sin The' (pronounced like "tay").

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Mark
Liberalism is a mental disorder. -M. Savage

“	Originally Posted By: Jade_Dragon_03 It's not a user name. That's his name in real life. He is Grandmaster Sin The' (pronounced like "tay").	”

Ooh.

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Yes, he's not a member of this forum.... as far as I know of anyway.

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Wait, you have to learn both xingyi and pakua for black sash? Two entire styles? Wha?