like these applacions. Has anyone used tiger claw applications in sparing, compertition or on the street for that mater ? How did they go down? What do you think of practicality?
Text included with above video-
[Quote: Shaolin masters like Wong Fei Hong were famous for their use of the Shaolin Double Tiger Claws. When powered by internal force, the gripping and clawing action of this technique can be used against virtually any attack.
Grandmaster Wong generously demonstrates some of the secrets of this formidable technique with me during a seminar in Toronto in 2004. What you cannot see in the video is how my teacher digs his fingers into me with every move. His fingers seem to always find their way into a soft spot of my arm, ribs, leg, or shoulders.
In 2003, my teacher gave me a demonstration of the crushing power of the Tiger Claw. He held my arm with his claw, and slowly increased the level of force. He told me to let him know as it became more painful.
The pain set in, but it was bearable. Sifu said that this was about 10% of his capacity. I asked him to please continue. The pain became more intense, but I held on. Sifu said "about 20%". I asked him to continue. By the time he reached 30%, the pain was excruciating, and I had to tap out. It felt like he could crush my elbow between his fingers.
I asked Sifu how he was measuring his percentages. He said that they were rough estimates, but that he was being conservative. He also pointed out that this was just raw crushing power, and did not involve any joint manipulation.
I hope you enjoy.
Anthony Korahais End quote]
All of these are hung kyun tiger techniques does anyone have any tiger techniques from other styles ?
You won't catch me using any of these techniques in sparring! My finger and grip strength is pretty darn weak. I need to do those real fingertip pushups and not the fake ones I currently do.
techniques are only as good if you put in the reps
having a natural reaction to an attack is an awesome thing
but you need to rep those certain moves to make them some what natural
I think that with anything in MA, whether you want to do a tiger claw or whatever, learning to apply concepts will always be superior to learning to apply techniques.
It is not just repetition. Repetition is the first step. The next is putting it in a fighting context, ie, with a heavy bag, with pads, with a person, where you are applying it on a physical something, a physical someone. I'm not saying that you learn it one day and the next day you spar with it. There are many intermediate steps that work up a fully random encounter.
Originally
Posted By: Doughboy
I think that with anything in MA, whether you want to do a tiger claw or whatever, learning to apply concepts will always be superior to learning to apply techniques.
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Hm! Things like 'entrance strategies' or 'stepping to avoid a blow' or even 'redirecting to different angles'. They're principles/concepts that are implemented by techniques. Where you pay less attention to having your hand _just so_ and your foot placed exactly 3" away from the other foot, and so on and so forth, and rather paying attention to the general things that have a much greater variance and can still work in practice. Or changing the technique to make up for a change in the situation. I've done the usual mistakes in san sau drills where you start out with the 'wrong' hand or even the wrong technique, and the (more advanced) partner STILL manages to deal with it even if he doesn't use the technique you're working on, because his knowledge of the concept and what he's trying to do is good.
I'm not saying technique doesn't have a place. But, if you teach someone a technique it is like it is stuck inside a vacuum. It cannot be anything besides that technique. But if you understand the concept behind the technique then you truly understand not just that technique, but many others. This cannot be achieved by correct Body Position alone.
For example I think it would be very beneficial to let some Tiger Claw students spar each other ( and hopefully a Western Boxer or any other style far removed from their own ) and let each other feel what hurts and what doesn't. What works and what doesn't. They would spar over the months they are practising and through this direct experience with the material they would gain an understanding of the concept of Tiger Claw which is far superior in my opinion to learning " place your index finger on this point and his arm at 45 degrees etc. ". All I was really trying to say .
Last edited by Doughboy; May 7th, 2008 at 02:44 PM.
...Thing is there 2 kinds of "tiger claw" styles - those that really use it as bread and butter, and actively train it with certain purposes in mind (as you very well mentionned), and those that just added it in there 'cause it looks cool. Lastly iBob if you're looking at grip strength as the be-all-and-end-all of tiger claw, you're mistaken. It's a nice to have, but it's missing the forest for the trees.
That said, there is a room for overlap between arts that start out teaching techniques and those that start out teaching concepts. Just like some arts start out hard and progress to soft, and others start soft and progress to hard. In the end the path you start with isn't so important as the end-result, ideally, is the same.
Take boxing for example, it's just about the quintessential "technique-based " art. No one's gonna harp on you for concepts when you first put on some gloves... But as you progress learning combo's, drilling then, and hit the ring you naturally come to understand things like cutting angles, pressing, drawing-in, etc. You just kindof pick-it-up along the way...
mok
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What is the sound of one hand clawing? -- chanh buddhist proverb
Originally
Posted By: Doughboy
i'm not talking about intellectual concepts. I'm talking about experiencial concepts. But I hear you . cool .
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I hear you as well, and it's a very good point. In fact, Hung Gar has often been described as a concept-based art. Many of our sets have these movements where techniques are not obvious, but what they do is teach positionning alignment, energies. The techniques themselves are fairly sparse and ordinary.
But ideally things are never so black and white: you can't teach concepts without demonstrating at least a few techniques (derived from these)... and do enough techniques hopefully the concepts will sink in.
__________________
What is the sound of one hand clawing? -- chanh buddhist proverb
But ideally things are never so black and white: you can't teach concepts without demonstrating at least a few techniques (derived from these)... and do enough techniques hopefully the concepts will sink in.
yes.thank you for posting this.real fighting.this is my style.im a big tiger fist fan (by the way.my sport makes it where i have to have mad finger,wrist,forearm strength.this style works well for me xD)i use punching alot with tiger fist.some guys try styles.grapples.all that junk.just garbege with this style.the dude in the secount video is the real deal! you see those push ups?not even on his finger tips,but on his thumbs!!! thank you again for posting.
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