FMA for dummies

Fair warning, this is one of those questions that I know full well sound kind of dumb, so excuse me if I ramble a bit, I just want to make myself perfectly clear.

For the past couple of months, I've been a little dissatisfied with my kung fu school. After examining my options I decided that the best thing to do would be to study a little something else on the side, and see if that made things better (in other words, I'm not entirely sure whether its my school or martial arts in general I'm dissatisfied with). After a lot of research I narrowed it down to a Kali school or an MMA school. Each one had its advantages. In my opinion, Kali is the coolest, most badass style there is. However I have a friend at the MMA school, and it's probably a better path towards competition, which I really want to try.

In the end, I decided to go with the MMA school, but this still leaves a part of me very unsatisfied. I really like Kali, but I need a slightly better source then the 10,000 youtube clips I've watched. I've also read a book, watched Human Weapon and the whole Mind, Body series...not exactly the best study. The problem with all these sources is that they tend to be VERY superficial. They don't examine the history, and they gloss over the vocabulary (which makes asking follow-up questions to other practitioners kinda hard).

So in short, I'm looking for a good book or DVD that gives a good background and vocabulary. A couple of other things I'm looking for specifically
1. In-depth explanations of footwork.
2. Any demonstration of "dumog". I keep hearing about this grappling aspect but haven't seen all that great a demonstration.
3. Lots of "siniwali"...it's awesome to watch and seems to be the heart of the training.
4. Ditto for "Hubad".

so I think that's everything. Anyone got any recommendations? Before anyone says it, I'll write it out here: I realize that no book or video can substitute a good teacher. I just want to get a good look at the training, from somewhere, cuz I just don't have the time and money to study it for real.

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1. Research your own experience
2. Absorb what is useful
3. Reject what is useless
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you could alternate your MMA with the FMA class

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"....if you're ever attacked by someone armed with a banana, your first thought has got to be to eat that banana. Thus leaving him unarmed and defenseless." - ace

A lot of what you learn in mma should be like the dumog- many of the same moves and counter moves just different names.

However the fact is that most FMA schools don't go that far into it so for those skills you might be better in the MMA school for a while.
The siniwali you can do a lot of that on your own and develope a good control level so you can progress with both if you spend the time needed and you will do fine.

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By nature we have an open mind by dogma we close it.

Filipino arts are awesome. You can compete with an FMA background if you want, weapon in hand or not, and you will get a more rich curriculum with FMA than with MMA--of course, that means more to work on so you might progress a bit more slowly.

The Inosanto Aademy has a number of videos you can purchase (I *think*), and they do all kinds of seminars throughout the year, so that might be an option for you as well.

As Aqira has already mentioned, dumog isnt much different than something like BJJ and ultimately each teacher will use a bit different types of things than others. In traditional dumog, the submissions are done slightly differently but its the concept that is important, which can be had from any type of ground fighting.

Good luck on your path! Just follow your heart and maintain steadfast motivation, and everything will work itself out! =)

Re: Siniwali: In a way, it can be the heart of the training. The one basic siniwali drill (Heaven, Earth, or Standard 6) with one stick above shoulder and the other chambered below on the same side. In my mind, that basic drill is basicly its own little subsystem. Those 3 strikes can be used as a whole myriad of little applications, from defense to offense, to transitions, even non-weapon apps...I find it to be a very profound little drill.

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PlumDragon Herbs: Dit Da Jow and Iron Palm Liniments

"When a handshake passes the elbow, it becomes Judo."

Good point for many FMA folks siniwali is a system in itself. Good basic methods that offer the average person most of what they need in a good defensive art.

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By nature we have an open mind by dogma we close it.

Alright, getting some good responses here and a well thought PM, so I thought I'd post a little more. There were some parts of my story that I didn't put into my first post, just so I could keep it short, however it looks like I should mention them now.....

“	Originally Posted By: Pope_Wingnut you could alternate your MMA with the FMA class	”

This is actually the perfect solution. The problem is that I'm very reluctant to leave my kung fu school, so I had settled on keeping kung fu and doing something else on the side. There is actually a school about 20 minutes away from me that does a JKD curriculum that combines FMA and MMA, but I was reluctant to give it a try. I'm always a little suspicious of JKD schools. They seem a bit cult-ish, and then tend to be filled with a lot of good fighters, but not so many good teachers. It's just a personal thing.

The decision to go with the MMA school over the FMA school has a lot to do with the fact that I've got a friend who trains there. Furthermore I feel like I could take up FMA at any point in my life without to much of a loss, but I'm only going to be young and dumb enough to jump into an octagon right now .....and on the purely practical side, my ground game really sucks. I seriously have no idea what to do after a knock someone over. Quick side note- I appriciate what you all said comparing dumog to BJJ.


So the reccomendations/reviews seem to revolve around 3 groups:

Dan Inosanto series- The knock against most of these seems to be that it's all a lot of really advanced stuff, but not so great at teaching the basics (i.e. you need a skilled practitioner to water it down for you). My main kung fu brother has had some really bad experiences with Inosanto/ Jessie Glover seminars, so I'm reluctant to buy these without a strong personal recommendation from anyone.

Paul Vunak- this guy has made a lot of videos, and so have his students. His movies and techniques actually have a very positive reputation, but to me he always seemed a little bit nuts (see aforementioned prejudice against JKD schools). Anyone have some thoughts on this?

Dog Brothers- This was brought to my attention, especially given my interest in MMA. They actually have a lot of videos specifically dedicated to the parts of FMA pratice that interest me, and the "Membership package" for a year is actually cheaper then the monthly rates of area schools. Anybody want to recommend the Dog Brothers?

Also, does anyone have any book recommendations? I'm a reader, and I'd love to get something I could just look over on my lunch break.

Lastly on an unrelated note, is it ok to practice your siniwali/striking on a heavy bag? I'm worried I'll end up ripping apart the bag as I get stronger.

__________________
1. Research your own experience
2. Absorb what is useful
3. Reject what is useless
4. Add what is essentially your own

came across something crazy. Has anyone every used this Bushido DVD: Martial Arts Instructional Video Rental, Martial Arts DVD Rental, Martial Arts Video Rental

it's basically Netfliks, but for martial arts DVDs. Now that money is not longer an issue, I just need to narrow down which of the million FMA videos are worth watching.

__________________
1. Research your own experience
2. Absorb what is useful
3. Reject what is useless
4. Add what is essentially your own

“	Originally Posted By: ace6foot8 There is actually a school about 20 minutes away from me that does a JKD curriculum that combines FMA and MMA, but I was reluctant to give it a try. I'm always a little suspicious of JKD schools.	”

Dont pay any attention to the name of a style, jstu who is teaching. If the guy running the JKD school is an Inosnto or Hartsell guy, get me a name and Ill check them out for you.

“	Originally Posted By: ace6foot8 Dan Inosanto series- The knock against most of these seems to be that it's all a lot of really advanced stuff, but not so great at teaching the basics (i.e. you need a skilled practitioner to water it down for you).	”

The person I trained in Kali with was a teacher under Insanto and Hartsell, so I can strongly recommend them as fantastic martial artists and teachers. However, I should make it abundantly clear that I know nothing of their seminars and videos and that if youre worried about not getting the basics, you should contact the Inosanto Academy and talk to someone there about it.

“	Originally Posted By: ace6foot8 Dog Brothers- This was brought to my attention, especially given my interest in MMA.	”

Good stuff there, cant go wrong with Dog Brothers, but again, theres no telling what youre going to get with a correspndence program...

“	Originally Posted By: ace6foot8 Lastly on an unrelated note, is it ok to practice your siniwali/striking on a heavy bag? I'm worried I'll end up ripping apart the bag as I get stronger.	”

YES!!
As long as you dont smack the bag all out full force, or with the ends of the stick, youll be fine, just make sure when you hit the bag that the end of the stick clears the bag so your hitting with the round of the stick and not scraping the edges against the bag.

I used to make it a ritual to work on watiks, several different siniwalis, Villibraillo, and a number of other combinations on and off the bag before class...

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PlumDragon Herbs: Dit Da Jow and Iron Palm Liniments

"When a handshake passes the elbow, it becomes Judo."

the place near my house is Jeet Kune Do Self-Defense Academy

be careful when it loads its got a bunch of sound clips that play. The teacher is Adrian Tandez (he studied under Paul Vunak). Any information you've got on these guys would be great.

__________________
1. Research your own experience
2. Absorb what is useful
3. Reject what is useless
4. Add what is essentially your own

i use a log instead of a bag

stapled an old towel to it to keep the noise down

and to give the sticks a little protection

but you can jit it as hard as you like

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"....if you're ever attacked by someone armed with a banana, your first thought has got to be to eat that banana. Thus leaving him unarmed and defenseless." - ace

a padded log is a good way to go. I have mainly been using my heavy bag and just like PlumDragon says be careful with the tip of the sticks. I am sure you can cut through the bag like that. I hit the bag full force, and try to keep the speed up at the same time.

ace6foot8 ,

That school looks good and he is trained by Paul Vunak and yes that is a good thing. I am sure you can check out the class before making up your mind about joining. I would say that Paul Vunak is the kind of teacher that could teach any Martial Artist for 5 minutes and they would be better for it.

I have a few Dan Inosanto videos and I treasure them don't get me wrong. There is stuff on there for beginners and experts and he covers many examples and drills. The reason people say they are not good to start with is the same thing that makes them great to check out once you have a basic start from somewhere else. If you did a few weeks at the JKD school and then watched a Dan Inosanto vid they would make a LOT more sense and teach you a lot more.

As for the Dog Brothers. I think Marc "Crafty Dog" Denny is one of the most talented Martial Artists on the planet. I don't know what their membership package is like, but DBMA are very good indeed.

“	Also, does anyone have any book recommendations? I'm a reader, and I'd love to get something I could just look over on my lunch break.	”

Dan Inosanto wrote a book called Filipino Martial Arts. Also, Bruce Lee's stuff of course .

Good luck with MMA school man. With a friend there you should have a blast.

I have not heard much about the Sayoc system in the last couple of years, but when I was around them I thought their system was effective and very structured for learning. They do put a lot of time on knife training and have a good mix of empty hand, stick, knife and basic ground . I understand the videos are done in a series which is good. one video leads into the next instead of jumping all over the place.

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By nature we have an open mind by dogma we close it.

Slightly off-topic but any of you fma guys got any opinions on silat vs fma, seriously considering joining a class soon.

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"It is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought the fool, than to open it and prove it so." KungFuTze
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind." T. Geisel

One of the things I didnt like about the Sayoc guys is that they have these giant harnesses with 18 blades and they go from one to the other as if in the real world you have a utility belt.

That being said I havent seen a FMA, Kali or silat system yet that had a lot of crap in it.

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One hit, see blood.

It's not enough to just not get hit

That's not really all that off-topic...from what I've seen Silat seems to be a little more empty handed oriented. From the looks of it, Silat was a little more influenced by kung fu, where as kali is just all about the machete. I may be totally off about that, but those are my observations.

__________________
1. Research your own experience
2. Absorb what is useful
3. Reject what is useless
4. Add what is essentially your own