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I study a system of Bagua Zhang that is comprised of many Xing-i movements, and have started a thread on the Bagua board titled "You got your chocolate in my peanut butter" I would be interested in any comments that any Xing-i practisioners may have on the subject. Thank you.

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Cool. Teach me

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This could be interesting, in Application i would see the adavantages of XingYi in Baguazhan but i don't see how you would incorporate strictly frontal moves with a circle. Im sure it can be done, sounds powerful but lets not forget Sun Style: Baguazhan, XingYi, and Taiji wonderful combo

Many older texts from the early part of the 1900's talk about several internal masters trading arts with each other. Sun Lu Tang was the most famous and public one recently. He taught a mixture of Tai Chi, Pa Kua and Hsing I. However several other masters of one art practiced another style when they met someone whose skill they respected. This developed several styles that evolved into interesting mixtures of Pa Kua and Tai Chi, Tai Chi and Hsing I, Hsing I and Pa Kua etc... including all three in some styles.
They do make a great style even more well rounded when they are mixed. Have a great time training.
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This is humorusly ironic, I am receiving more replies on the invite to the thread, than the actual thread itself. no matter, I am interested in the imput. I am studying Jiang Rongqiao's "original style" Bagua Zhang". Jiang was an experienced Xing-i player when taught Bagua by Zhang Zhao Dong. I am a beginner, but my teacher teaches both Xing-i, and Bagua; this has given me some insight into the subject. I hope to learn Xing-i sometime in the future, but right now I am devoting myself to Bagua. That aside, I have been given an interest in Xing-i by seeing it performed impresively. Within the form I'm learning there are certian moves like "monkey picking fruit" or a certian turning step that screams Xing-i. Applicationwise (keep in mind I am a beginner), I see it as circular combat, moving around the opponent in a flanking style manuver, and then shooting in at an angle(straightline). Or a multiple opponent situation where circular principles are being used, and then the "rythum" is broken/changed with a strightline attack from one opponent to another. I know that this is a very base explanation, I'm just wanting to get the topic out on the table. It is also my understanding that Bagua and Xing-i are often(bordering on traditionally) taught at the same schools. I'm interested in any imput. Thanks

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For what it is worth Hsing-i and Ba Gua techniques are practically the same. In our BaGua the Gao we have eight mother forms with eight techniques in each one. This gives us 64 forms and endless combinations of forms from them. Many BaGua techniques are short and straight. Hsing-I on the other hand is very straight or maybe just a part of a big circle. Think about it. I was never trained to just go straight ahead. There are principals and rules that govern Hsing-i actions. The side step or P'en that we use is part of a circle. To say we are just karate with chi is absurd.

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“	Hsing-i and Ba Gua techniques are practically the same	”

internally, they are very different

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"What can be said at all can be said clearly; and whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent" - Wittgenstein, Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus

Internally the power is channeled differently, but the internal connections you have to make for both is the same and the hard part. That's why is relatively easy to learn other internal arts if you already have a good skill level in one.

There are only ever so many principles that may be adhered to. These do not change from internal to internal. The manner in which they are used can be very different.

In this, I agree with StormMountain - once you have a grasp on the principles, one may easily learn a new way of applying them.

However, there are still great differences in the way this is done. Compare Sun TaiJi and Chen for example.

RT

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"What can be said at all can be said clearly; and whereof one cannot speak, thereof one must be silent" - Wittgenstein, Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus

"To say that we are just karate with chi is absurd" Who is the basphemer that told you Xing-i is karate with chi I don't have anything against karate players, but thems' fight'n words! I don't study Xing-i, YET; but I have seen it done by my instructor. One word: " D@@@@@@@MMMMMNNNNN!" That stuff is powerful.

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All great truths begin as heresy.

Have to agree with circle walker on that one

I agree also, but I have seen Hsing-i described that way. I have also heard that it is all linear and that is also just a bunch of bunk. Hsing-i is very circular but only on a small part of a big circle. I learned the Gao BaGua and Hsing-i and apart from somedifferences they are practically the same. Different approaches but ending the same. If, they were exactly the same there would probably be only one name.

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