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March 9th, 2004, 08:28 AM
|  | Advisor   | | Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 6,090
Rep Power: 100 | | | I would say, the five fists are the obvious usages of a fist/body movement to attack during this time, and the "elements" are the scissors-paper-stone of some guy back at some point having too much time to talk and too many people to listen. I don't think that activation schemes of qigong exercises like calming down, stimulation, etc., go hand in hand with a power generation by chance. Or by some heavenly principle. A fist is oriented by what you can do to someone else, and how you can generate power using the LEVERS the body owns. A medical process is oriented at the metabolism. No direct correlation, other than that power generation relies on certain metabolisms (ALWAYS the same).
Emotionally, I want to calm down in certain situations to gain balance, while in a fight, I don't like my power metabolism to shut down. Especially not because hey, now it's metal time baby, calm down a meridian that provides 40% muscle contraction boost because some guy in rich mans clothes drew a nice pentagram on a paper "associating" it with some metabolic procedures.  |
March 9th, 2004, 08:29 AM
|  | Retired from active duty.   | | Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Sheffield, United Kingdom Style(s): Xing Yi Quan Year(s): 15
Posts: 2,525
Rep Power: 38 | | | I love pi. I think its one of the easiest forms to learn but the most difficult to master. I feel that the 'chopping' action is more of a whiplash, as in casting the fly in fly-fishing. The impact we have been shown, is either to hit the head or the top of the lungs/collar bone area. The force is not strictly downwards, but perhaps more of a diagonal downwards motion. This has two effects:
1. When striking the head, it will cause a whiplash effect on the persons neck- temporarily stunning them if done correctly, allowing you to followup with something great, like a killer tuo application.
2. When striking the chest, the impact does not flow freely through the ribs like a direct frontal impact. Thus it will both create a shockwave effect, as generated by the temporal deformation of the upper ribs/collar bone, through the the lung, into the lower back area. Additionally it will also compress the upper vertebrae (from the impact) and the lower vertebrae (from the shockwave) causing temporary numbness-paralysis depending on the size of the force.
Furthermore, this shockwave will be transmitted down through the spine into the opponents legs. If the opponent has (at the time of impact) a mal-aligned leg, damage from torsive forces may be included as well (I have documented proof of a person receiving a broken leg from being hit from pi).
Now. Come on, lets turn it into EF and say that my above statements are crap, and that it'd never work..blah blah blah... |
March 9th, 2004, 08:35 AM
| | Advisor | | Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 6,090
Rep Power: 100 | | | Why should we |
March 9th, 2004, 08:40 AM
| | Retired from active duty. | | Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Sheffield, United Kingdom Style(s): Xing Yi Quan Year(s): 15
Posts: 2,525
Rep Power: 38 | | | Oh coz thats what happened there...I believe Ken Fish talked about the applications for his forms and then went down in a blaze of glory, from the "i dont agree principle" to the your forms are ****.
I can just see this thread going the same way since many people on EF also take an interest on here too. |
March 9th, 2004, 08:44 AM
|  | uk ba gua baby!!! | | Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Gloucestershire, England Style(s): Xing Yi, Ba Gua etc etc Year(s): 18
Posts: 1,139
Rep Power: 22 | | Good post Li - but you aree only talking about the application of the form.
Pi chuan is movement up to down - at its core. This can be applied when striking - with the hands, elbows, shoulders, hips, feet, etc etc it can be applied when throwing. You movement can look Nothing like the form but you can still be using Pi.
i like to think about the principles behind the forms - looking at the forms as they stand you will become a proficient, hard, hsing i fighter. Looking at the principles the forms are teaching you and applying them to anything - you will have a spontanious solution to every problem. Just IMO. 
I agree with you Li - Pi is probably one of the hardest of the 5 to truely understand.
Cheers
Chris
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March 9th, 2004, 08:45 AM
| | Advisor | | Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 6,090
Rep Power: 100 | | | I thought the applications would look obvious, straight forward. If a fist is a whipping motion on the horizontal plane, every such strike is a normal application. If you make it work in reality is your own problem. You can come up with any such move in any situation where it makes sense, penetrating the structure of an opponent. Wether your left foot is in sync with moon and having the correct element is not so important. |
March 9th, 2004, 08:47 AM
| | uk ba gua baby!!! | | Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Gloucestershire, England Style(s): Xing Yi, Ba Gua etc etc Year(s): 18
Posts: 1,139
Rep Power: 22 | | hey Li - people that ridicule your idea of something just have a superiority complex ' I AM RIGHT!' that is one reason why i dont tend to post too much over on EF. It seems that there - the more posts you have the more you MUST know about your style!  pretty funny really - while they are posting - i am training!
chris
__________________
When all are one and one is all
To be a rock and not to roll.
- Led Zeppelin
Last edited by chris_davis01; March 9th, 2004 at 08:48 AM.
Reason: change of name
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March 9th, 2004, 08:47 AM
| | Retired from active duty. | | Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Sheffield, United Kingdom Style(s): Xing Yi Quan Year(s): 15
Posts: 2,525
Rep Power: 38 | | | Its hard to talk about principles rather than just applications since you'd have to set scenes, so that people can follow the 'story' so to speak. Better to just talk about apps me thinks. Besides, cant give all the game away, coz then people wouldnt need to take lessons ;-) |
March 9th, 2004, 08:49 AM
| | uk ba gua baby!!! | | Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Gloucestershire, England Style(s): Xing Yi, Ba Gua etc etc Year(s): 18
Posts: 1,139
Rep Power: 22 | | LOL - good point!! My lips are sealed! LOL
__________________
When all are one and one is all
To be a rock and not to roll.
- Led Zeppelin
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March 9th, 2004, 08:53 AM
| | Advisor | | Join Date: Nov 1999
Posts: 6,090
Rep Power: 100 | | | A principle is that if you strike someone approaching downwards on the arms he will fall in, if you strike them upwards he will go up, if you do it sidewise he will turn. Another principle is, the harder you strike the more damage you make.
I think that's enough principles for the start. Now, follow up applications. |
March 9th, 2004, 08:54 AM
|  | Fear is the Mind Killer | | Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: MA Style(s): Long Men Jia Quan Year(s): 27
Posts: 4,983
Rep Power: 81 | | | Isn't it obvious
So you can bash a guy five ways from tuesday.
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One hit, see blood.
It's not enough to just not get hit |
March 9th, 2004, 09:08 AM
| | uk ba gua baby!!! | | Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Gloucestershire, England Style(s): Xing Yi, Ba Gua etc etc Year(s): 18
Posts: 1,139
Rep Power: 22 | | Follow up - Its gotta be Beng Chuan!! Classical Combo!
__________________
When all are one and one is all
To be a rock and not to roll.
- Led Zeppelin
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March 9th, 2004, 09:11 AM
|  | Venerable Student | | Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: south florida Year(s): @30
Posts: 111
Rep Power: 6 | | | Great input so far, but what about the structural requirements of Pi. And, does one practice pi chuan ( the form ) just to get a good strike down, or is there more to it
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March 9th, 2004, 09:16 AM
| | Fear is the Mind Killer | | Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: MA Style(s): Long Men Jia Quan Year(s): 27
Posts: 4,983
Rep Power: 81 | | | “ | Originally
Posted By: jdhsingi
Great input so far, but what about the structural requirements of Pi. And, does one practice pi chuan ( the form ) just to get a good strike down, or is there more to it | ” | |
HAH, I just read your sig.
Thats f'ing great, I'm gonna steal it.
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One hit, see blood.
It's not enough to just not get hit |
March 9th, 2004, 10:05 AM
| | Venerable Student | | Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: south florida Year(s): @30
Posts: 111
Rep Power: 6 | | | “ | Originally
Posted By: PaiLumUmar
HAH, I just read your sig.
Thats f'ing great, I'm gonna steal it. | ” | |
No problem....enjoy
But, isn't it the truth......
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It doesn't hurt any less if you act like a puxxy.
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