Countering

Everyone has to be on this side of the fence at one time or another, but I'd like to hear what people thoughts are about countering. And let's keep away from the basic opponent strikes, and I counter stuff. Let's get a little more in depth about this shall we? Basically, most people's answers should lean towards fundamentals/principles IMO... but we shall see.

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It's all about the nitty gritty.......

depends on

position

relative movement

and intent

in my opinion

:P

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"...any theory that satisfies the facts demands assumptions which are completely absurd."

Aleister Crowley

It just depends...

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Terrorists aren't overseas. They're at the gas pump.
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I hear and I forget. I see and I remember. I do and I understand. -- Kung Fu-tzu (Confucius)

Alot of it depends on awareness - on what you're trying to counter.

Somethimes your countering response may be exactly what the other wants you to do, and it takes alot of 2-man drills/sparring to gradually increase that awareness.

Also with too much emphasis on countering it's really easy to become a bridge-chaser, and forget about hitting the guy (I know I'm guilty of this).

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What is the sound of one hand clawing? -- chanh buddhist proverb

and opportunity of course

no opportunity no counter

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"...any theory that satisfies the facts demands assumptions which are completely absurd."

Aleister Crowley

Most of Judo is based on counter-techniques. You force your opponent to do something such as step forward on a foot or lean in a certain way, then counter that movement with a movement of your own.

Concerning striking countering the main principle to remember is...

It's impossible to cover everything all at once.
If he is touching you with one of his weapons then he has an area that is wide open.
Often times, even if he is focusing on covering one area over others then something else is wide open.
This is why elite striker throw combinations.
And yes, the only way to become adept at this is live drilling over and over and over......

Peace-
Cam

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Rock On!
Cam
"Raise up your mind....."

A counter should be viewed for what it really is and that is a combination of a few factors. A counter by sequence is a reaction to something and that means it is a reaction to something of substance ( an object or an event). The basics or fundamentals when understood shows that substance is a result of application of the principals of fundamental law.

One thing that the application of these laws does is that it produces an outcome and that outcome will always have or be a condition, and be situational. The counter to that is not in opposition to it but instead it is a part of it and combined forms a larger subject.

To understand a counter requires understanding that larger subject and the applications ( functions) that make it.

So one of the first steps in training should be start to train the way you look at things and that should IMO start with counters are always connections. Connections can and do have a form of interaction so the view should not be of action and reaction it should be the combination or interaction.
Mort schools /styles/methods teach if this do that and that is very limiting. The fact is that’s limited viewing and limited understanding of how things work.

A few things that factor into counters.
When a counter is contemplated it starts off with being restrictive, as a connection it is within the restricted parameters of the original condition.

Counters of substance form dimensional outcomes and all outcomes have two divisions and they are existent and non-existent. As cam stated if he is there then there is a place he is not. Existent must include non-existent just as capable must include non-capable. IE the basics of things like balance in Ju Jitsu

I would suggest being careful about being acceptant of the mindset of the those answers like "depends " as that may imply options but also points out a lack of the whole view.

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You are not where you have been and you are not where you are going you are only here.

Our view is that a counter is our opening into their space.

They strike and we redirect their energy while moving in and sticking to them to restrict further attacks, all the while striking them at multiple points/angles to disrupt and injure.
We either close the gate and work around them or open it and go right in and crush, either way our counter is our strike, we don't play games, we seek to crush and destroy immediately. No use in leaving an enemy standing and able...

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Oh THAT'S how that works!

Why counter. If in a situation you can't walk away from simply attack.Not very sophistacated I admit.It is on the other hand an action that may give you an opertunity to walk or run away.

Gee : "Why counter. If in a situation you can't walk away from simply attack"

whilst i agree with what you say

its not always possible to see a fight comming

the sucker punch for example

or the random nutter

not every confrontation starts with

"you want some?"

aqira : "Mort schools /styles/methods teach if this do that and that is very limiting"

this struck a cord with me

i totally agree

and to echo what cam said

only sparring or fighting or chi sau or whatever free drills your training incorporates

will allow this to be understood

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"...any theory that satisfies the facts demands assumptions which are completely absurd."

Aleister Crowley

I understand the answers given, although these answers still hinder on your opponent moves, then this option is available. Like Aqira stated, that is a limited understanding.

Most of us should understand that if one weapon is in use, that creates another opening. But there are things to factor in.... and these are found in every style. At least it should be. The argument of depends.... is not what I was thinking of... lol. And I know the both of you that posted that answer has a deeper understanding than this.


Motion itself is also a counter. The distance you use, the angles you take... etc. Strike over strike IMO, is a basic counter. And yes Cam, only actual live training and drilling can help in this area.


Anyone else?

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It's all about the nitty gritty.......

ooooooo he's a hard audience

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"...any theory that satisfies the facts demands assumptions which are completely absurd."

Aleister Crowley

“	Originally Posted By: Wingnut Gee : "Why counter. If in a situation you can't walk away from simply attack" whilst i agree with what you say its not always possible to see a fight comming the sucker punch for example or the random nutter not every confrontation starts with "you want some?" aqira : "Mort schools /styles/methods teach if this do that and that is very limiting" this struck a cord with me i totally agree and to echo what cam said only sparring or fighting or chi sau or whatever free drills your training incorporates will allow this to be understood	”

The only counter I've encountered to said sucker punch & or nutter are luck A hard head & some body conditioning.
Other than that floating & sparring with as many dif. body types & styles seems the best way to prep yourself.Why limit yourself to only your style or system when you go play?It seems logical to me that the more diverse the activties the sharper you make yourself.
I could on the other hand be totally wrong.I have not had a great deal of formal training.

“	The only counter I've encountered to said sucker punch & or nutter are luck A hard head & some body conditioning.	”

I think awareness is the best counter to those things mentioned. Where you hang out and who you hang out with are very important in the world of self defense these days.

Also, we need to differentiate between countering and defense.
A hard head and a conditioned body are simply attributes that lend themselves to defense. They are not an active defense and definitely are not "counters".

Peace-
Cam

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Rock On!
Cam
"Raise up your mind....."