Question?

Anyone know anything about these animal styles

1. horse
2. elephant
3. rooster
4. lion

I read somewhere that horse style is 90% defense.
Is this true

My sifu says that lion in our style is very similar to tiger.
i think hung fut has lion style too.If anyone knows hung fut or about hung fut or any style that has lion. is your lion style similar to tiger

any reply helpful.
thanks.

jmd161

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History will be kind to me for I intend to write it ~ Sir Winston Churchill

I think it's very stupid to 'create' a 'style' called elephant, unicorn, horse, blah blah blah...


Why do people even do that


In fact, plz post some links so I can get an idea of what they are like.


But I've never heard of any masters of those or anything about them.

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But,

each animal style i listed is part of my blacktiger style.I try not to ask my sifu so many questions about advanced techniques i've not reached yet.He tells me that i need to focus on what i've learned and on what i'm learning now.

He answers all my questions but i try to limit them.so that's why from time to time i will ask questions about different techniques if anyone knows anything about them.

jmd161

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History will be kind to me for I intend to write it ~ Sir Winston Churchill

The four animals you speak of actually have styles, full forms and all, based after them.

The horse involves alot of kicking, some ground work (also kicking upward), and some airial moves imitating the uplifting hoof attacks and such.

The rooster is similar to crane and uses a pecking foot kick, raking hands (claws), and jumping/quick jutting movements for balance and defense.

The elephant has it's form in many older kung fu systems. I've seen it used in 10 animal, 12 animal forms but mostly promoted through Choy Li Fut. It involveds lower kicks, spear hands (tusks), swinging arm fists, (trunk) and other specifics for that system.

The lion style is being discussed in the animal styles and systems forum. There is a link there and that site on Lion style should be up and running soon as I talked with the instructor last week.

JKD327, how long have you actually been in martial arts You seem to have limited knowledge of styles Animal system are very old and are the basis most much of the martial arts out there being taught. For some schools and students, there is much spirituality involved in the learning of animal systems. The more you learn about the world of martial arts this will become more evident as animal styles are a majority in some areas. Good luck.

If you need links here are a couple that should work for you...

http://www.shaolin.com/styles_shaolin.html

http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/4918/90749

http://www.rucus.ru.ac.za/~kung-fu/history.html

I hope these help you Let me know if you need more

Suhfu alan cicco,

thank you for the info it helps alot.

jmd161

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History will be kind to me for I intend to write it ~ Sir Winston Churchill

7 years on and off. so I'd say about 4 years total, if you counted studying every day.

Sorry, I never really learned much about CMA styles.

I've read about 10 hours total, and seen a lot of it. But most of it seems like crap to me.

Not unless it's something like wingchun, which is more modern self-defense based without flashy movements. Really, a kick to the head in a fight with someone who knows how to defend themself moderately will not work, and you will most likely get wiped on the floor over and over.

Now, I'm not totally criticizing CMA's, but it's just my opinion, because some of it is actually very good, like mantis trapping skills.

I know that animal styles were before any other style, and all martial arts today are based on animals. ex: Karate - snake and crane.

But if one just studies CMA's purely without their own thing/street smartness added to it (get what I am saying), they will get creamed.

This is like learning wushu, and trying to fight with it. Yeah, the wushu-ist may be able to hit the other guy a few times, but in the end, I think the other guy who knows something more vagabond-ish (ex: ninjutsu, or a grappling style) will win.


(none of this applies to Shuai-Chiao) Shuai Chiao is good.

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Land of the Slave, home of the Knave.

Ok, that makes more sense then and thanks for your opinion it is a good one.

You are very correct about people needing true down and nasty fighting skills to know how to apply kung fu/wu shu when they train in it. Too many instructors talk out of theory and no real experience, as in knowing the techniques work. I am not in any way promoting asking for fights or seeking areas where it happens to get one going, but everyone should have very intense sparring and reaction drills that have a sense of violence and nasty street fighting about them.

Should students have a chance of getting a bruise or cut, heck yes they should! That is how I train and teach and not a single one of my students have failed in their self defense when needing it on the streets...and many have.

Now, students shouldn't train 24-7 like that or you'll risk too much injury and burn out, that is counterproductive but enough should be taught and practiced to keep everyone on their toes and clean and crisp in technique or ability.

I do agree that you have probably not seen a "good" instructor execute and apply wu shu for you to show you how it really works and how nasty it is. There are alot of over night success teachers that basically are made of balsa wood when it comes to skill and power in animal styles or kung fu in general.

VERY well said suhfu alan cicco.

This includes the explination of the animals and your response to JKD. Much better than I could have!

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"Arm yourself because no one else here will save you" - Chris Cornell

“	Originally posted by JKD327 This is like learning wushu, and trying to fight with it. Yeah, the wushu-ist may be able to hit the other guy a few times, but in the end, I think the other guy who knows something more vagabond-ish (ex: ninjutsu, or a grappling style) will win. (none of this applies to Shuai-Chiao) Shuai Chiao is good.	”

Welll the main difference between P.R.C. wushu and animal styles is that animal styles were designed to fight with. Not knowing alot about CMA makes you a little bit ignorant on the subject of traditional vs. wushu. Wushu is in fact a modern martial art. However it is one designed not for fighting but for looks. This is not true at all about the animal styles they were designed to hurt people. If someone tries to use wushu on the street they will lose to something more vagabondish simply because everything is more vagabondish then a group of styles designed for forms competitions and invented in the 1950's.

you may not realize this about wushu and if you dont you probably think all kung-fu is like that which it isnt.

suhfu alan cicco,

Can you give me a little more info on these styles.

Such as.....

I hear horse style is all defense. Is this true

I would guess the elephant style is a very powerful style.Would that be right

lion,rooster,etc.......

any info would be helpful.

jmd161

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History will be kind to me for I intend to write it ~ Sir Winston Churchill

“	Originally posted by suhfu alan cicco Should students have a chance of getting a bruise or cut, heck yes they should!	”

What do you mean "cut"

Several styles sound weird or unusual because they are not out in the public light or as popular as others. That doesn't mean they are any less effective as the popular styles everyone knows about off the cuff. Remember at one time Mantis, Tiger and Tai Chi were new ideas and concepts as well. If the style is well thought out and has basic and advanced level concepts it will be useful in both training and fighting. No matter what its background.

As for learning Wu Shu and trying to learn to fight with it, that is a difficult problem. It is similar to trying to learn gymnastics or swimming and trying to morph it into a fighting style. Granted Wu Shu is based off the fighting arts so it has some concepts all ready in tact, but for years it has been performed with out any martial applications. The movements are inherently performed to look nice and not have any power snap force or application behind it. To fight with it I would think you would have to be extremely careful because you could hurt yourself badly.

On the other hand I also think it doesn't matter what style you learn or practice as to what will beat what. It is all in the practitioner, a hard working Tae Kwon Do practitioner will beat a lazy Kung Fu stylist any day.

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