Local BJJ Test

One of the customers at my store started asking me about martial arts earlier this year. He is a good guy and would call him a friend except that I haven't seen him outside of my store. At any rate he was looking for martial arts schools to join. I let him know my opinions about what was offered in the area, what to look for, and what would probably be best to help him reach his goals.

In the end he went with a BJJ school in High Point and has really enjoyed it thus far. This past Saturday he told me he was testing for his first belt. I was actually very interested in the methods of this test because it was totally different than anything I've done, including Japanese Juijitsu.

He said a BJJ blackbelt was brought in from out of state, and a lot of the BJJ schools in the state (and some from Virginia and Tennessee) came for the test/seminar. The cost was $60.00 for the guy I talked with, and the day was comprised of 4-5 hours of drills and then sparring.

The part that got me was that the students were not graded on the drills at all, but rather only on the sparring. On top of that the students sparred with fresh higher-ranked belts. In the end the BJJ blackbelt said everyone needs to work on their stamina, and proceeded to fail everyone.

This was very shocking to me since our Kung Fu tests are similar. The same Saturday I was helping test some students going for their 2^nd Rank. They performed all the stance holding, forms, drills, chin na, ect... for about 4.5 hours as well, then sparred with us testers (who were fresh). However, when we take students to exhaustion through a comprehensive test the sparring at the end is ideally when they have nothing left. Its a test of mental resiliance and willpower to push the body.

I found it both odd and bizarre the BJJ test placed so much emphasis on Sparring once fatigued, and so little on knowledge of technique. In JJJ I had specific techniques I had to know on top of sparring at the end.

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"You must eat bitter before you can taste sweet"- Iron & Silk
"I see no virtue where I smell no sweat"
"Arm yourself because no one else here will save you" - Chris Cornell

I think you'll find that the emphasis in BJJ is on making the techniques work against a resisting opponent - you can look as crisp as anything in a drill or demonstrating the technique but unless you can get them to work against a committed opponent, they are useless.

I think getting the students to spar once fatigued is also a good idea and, if anything places even more emphasis on technique - if you're tired there is less chance of you using strength or attributes to make the techniques work and your setups have to be perfect.

Sparring in this manner also test mental strength but all the focus and mental strength in the world is no good if you still get your ass kicked, you can be as game and hardy as anything but unless you can hang at the level you want to be promoted to, you can forget about it. If you can hold your own and beat students ranked higher than you in BJJ then you will generally be promoted. I think the exception to this is at brown and black belt level (generally 10 years plus) where you should be able to teach as well, having said that, I think there are some very good BJJ black belts that are awesome on the mat and in the ring who can't teach very well, it depends on the individual I suppose.

I actually think that this method of promotion is brilliant and is the reason why the standards in BJJ have remained fairly high - you're not going to end up with any 3 year old BJJ blackbelts anytime soon.

I agree with a lot of this and a lot of what you said Doug.

Right now I am going off of second hand information, but it seemed that at no point was anyone graded on Drilling the techniques. What I find unusual about this is that even though an individual might only want to use a handful of techniques in sparring that he feels most comfortable with, he must still know how to perform the others so as to teach others.

From my experience I was horrible at executing Shoulder or Hip throws because of my size, but I was still required to know how to pull them off. But this goes back to what you said about teaching. Across the board, in every walk of life, some people can teach well and some can't...and it usually has nothing to do with an individual's ability within a given skill.

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"You must eat bitter before you can taste sweet"- Iron & Silk
"I see no virtue where I smell no sweat"
"Arm yourself because no one else here will save you" - Chris Cornell

Wow, my BJJ instructor said we had a belt testing coming up soon. I told him I'd love to come even though I'm not ready to test yet (my own assuption). He told me not to worry but to show up and test, "We'll get some stripes on your belt." Word. I had no idea what to expect so at least this thread tells me to just keep doing what I'm doing and I'll be fine. lol, He didn't set a date for it yet but I'll let you know how it goes after it happens.

Ok, on topic - as far as a BJJ viewpoint is concerned, being able to pull a move off when you're tired proves your understanding of said technique better than anything else.

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There are many paths at the base of the mountain but all who reach it's peak see the same moon.

That is very true Jubei.

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"You must eat bitter before you can taste sweet"- Iron & Silk
"I see no virtue where I smell no sweat"
"Arm yourself because no one else here will save you" - Chris Cornell

A friend of mine that does JJJ told me of the same type of testing. He needed to show said techniques, performed drills, then sparred. Hmmmm, when I say it like that, it sounds like how other styles performs their testing. Although their intent and focuses may vary.

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It's all about the nitty gritty.......

Thing is...all that Drilling was a non-factor.

Everything hinged on whether you impressed the BB with your sparring at the end...at least that is my understanding.

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"You must eat bitter before you can taste sweet"- Iron & Silk
"I see no virtue where I smell no sweat"
"Arm yourself because no one else here will save you" - Chris Cornell

The Drilling helps keep the techniques fresh in your mind and re-generates your familiarity with them before the sparring. It actually helps you as a "refresher course" before you test.

They are paying attention to the drilling, just not as much.

They don't really care if someone can do a move statically. That has no bearing on one's ability to fight. They are watching the student's ability to do the technique but in a live setting. Often times the higher ranked belts are instructed on how to attack the testing students so the testers can see certain techniques in action.

Peace-
Cam

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Rock On!
Cam
"Raise up your mind....."

Gotcha. That makes more sense.

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"You must eat bitter before you can taste sweet"- Iron & Silk
"I see no virtue where I smell no sweat"
"Arm yourself because no one else here will save you" - Chris Cornell

Yup, definitely makes sense. We also do that in our testing, although I'm not up for testing for a few more years. We do "playing" with BB's from other styles, if we lose then there's no promotion. And that's just the testing for Brown.

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It's all about the nitty gritty.......

I like learning how other styles test. I just tested for my Green Belt. In our Lung Shou Pai school, we are allowed to test for advancement every three months. In the single belt tests (when you're not testing on multiple ranks for a class advancement: beginner to intermediate, intermediate to advanced, advanced to Black Belt), the student has to display proper execution of technique of level material and pass an endurance test. Most students who put forth a legitimate effort in the beginner ranks will pass, but from intermediate ranks to Black Belt the quality and preciseness of technique execution are more closely scrutinized. If in the higher ranks the student doesn't show consistent improvement, proper technique execution, and attend class regularly, they will not be allowed to test. The Lung Jow Pai curriculum is designed to produce an adult black belt in about 3 years, assuming the individual performs and advances each rank as scheduled. The Black Belt test is 2 days long. It consists of all previous level material, defending against multiple attackers (3 or 4) at a time, sparing, and a 5 min. endurance test. A Black Belt in my class did a 1 hour endurance test. Advancement may seem rapid, but believe me, it is NOT EASY. A Lung Shou Pai student must really EARN every belt. One of the things I really appreciate is that we get to interact and get feedback from the Si gong of our style when we test. It is a real familial atmosphere in our style.

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He who sours the grapes of another' s vine will taste the bitterness of his own wine......
- Grey Dragon

Our tests are very similar, but they include a note from your teacher about how hard you have been training, and some "extra" points like staying after class to practice some more, attending more classes than those you are supposed to (my Sensei wont charge you for extra classes), he told me one of the reasons he gave me my current rank is that even if I had too much work, I made an extra effort to arrive (sometimes late) and train hard, and if I missed a class I always replaced it, sometimes twice. Always training hard and doing my homework.

Your hard work will be rewarded.

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He who sours the grapes of another' s vine will taste the bitterness of his own wine......
- Grey Dragon