Does motion move?

To sidetrack a little

Motion in or of an object is through by and because of an objective.


When there is a life force it may be considered intent
when there is no life force it may be considered effect

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Agreed, but, is this independent of subjective (observed) reality

subjective reality is a result of this formula- it becomes the act or event and it is the application that determines the subject

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TAO

Does there need to be an observer to have motion
depends on what is meant by the observer.

Heat is an effective substance; it can cause change, what observes the change
When heat is applied to water and it becomes steam is there motion
There is a change at least in the stature but at the core it is a separation of molecules yet the core substance has not changed into something else it simply has changed in its collective outcome.
Instead of change maybe it has exchanged.

Exchange meaning that the effect of something on something else is an exchange between the two. The exchange is based on the relationship or interaction between the two. The result is what is now different by this relationship. Still has anything actually moved

Who or what has observed the exchange; the one affected the one effecting or both

Does it have to be aware to observe, based on the changes in conditions of substances the answer appears to be no. We may assume that observation requires awareness but then we are basing that on a limited concept of what awareness is.

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You are not where you have been and you are not where you are going you are only here.

An interesting note on Heisenberg. I can't remeber exactly the source (Sorry!) but I remember reading about an experiment involving sub-atomic particles (I believe these were taking place in the huge particle accelerators in Texas and another huge accelerator whose location I can't remeber now). Researchers were finding that identical experiments were leading to different results, differences based on the expectations of the observer. They discovered that the expectations of the scientist observing the experiment were effecting the behaivor of the particles. Quantum physics comes one step closer to coming full circle and returning to Tao!

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Taijisd


The more I know, the less I learn; the more I learn, the less I know.

BTW Aqira, we are getting pretty close to being able to combine the "simple" thread with the "motion" thread here, aren't we I suspect you knew we'd arrive at this point from the beginning.

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Taijisd


The more I know, the less I learn; the more I learn, the less I know.

would I ever have a scheme

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I don't know about a scheme, but most times allowing a person to arrive at a point by his/her own thought process is best. I think that's the best way to teach or make a point; it internalizes the idea in a way that spouting knowledge never could.

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Taijisd


The more I know, the less I learn; the more I learn, the less I know.

I can not “teach you anything” however I can make a path in front of you, draw you to it, and guide your travel. This path if it appears new to you, will become a path of discovery, and as you discover you “teach” yourself.

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You are not where you have been and you are not where you are going you are only here.

“	Originally posted by Taijisd An interesting note on Heisenberg. I can't remeber exactly the source (Sorry!) but I remember reading about an experiment involving sub-atomic particles (I believe these were taking place in the huge particle accelerators in Texas and another huge accelerator whose location I can't remeber now). Researchers were finding that identical experiments were leading to different results, differences based on the expectations of the observer. They discovered that the expectations of the scientist observing the experiment were effecting the behaivor of the particles. Quantum physics comes one step closer to coming full circle and returning to Tao!	”

Quantum physics was very good at proving very old theories to be right.
Old Buddhist and Taoist scriptures (also some Indian Veda's for that matter) are full with examples that now are "proven" by science.

There's nothing new here...
As below, as above...

It's all the same
Space is not the final frontier... The mind is...

Chief108

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“	Question Authority. Question Society. Question Reality. Question Yourself. Question your conclusions, your judgments, your answers. Question this. If you question everything thoroughly enough, the truth will eventually hit you upside the head and you will know. But here’s a warning: It won’t be what you imagined. It won’t be even close.	”

all hail Martyr Fakka

The simplicity of motion is too obvious to be known by the mind.

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You are not where you have been and you are not where you are going you are only here.

“	Originally Posted By: aqira The simplicity of motion is too obvious to be known by the mind.	”

exactly...

word up man...

Chief108

__________________

“	Question Authority. Question Society. Question Reality. Question Yourself. Question your conclusions, your judgments, your answers. Question this. If you question everything thoroughly enough, the truth will eventually hit you upside the head and you will know. But here’s a warning: It won’t be what you imagined. It won’t be even close.	”

all hail Martyr Fakka

“	Originally Posted By: Taijisd An interesting note on Heisenberg. I can't remeber exactly the source (Sorry!) but I remember reading about an experiment involving sub-atomic particles (I believe these were taking place in the huge particle accelerators in Texas and another huge accelerator whose location I can't remeber now). Researchers were finding that identical experiments were leading to different results, differences based on the expectations of the observer. They discovered that the expectations of the scientist observing the experiment were effecting the behaivor of the particles. Quantum physics comes one step closer to coming full circle and returning to Tao!	”

This definitly is interesting, however, I would DEFINITLY need to see documentation to even start to believe that, even if it were true, I find it hard to believe that science would admit it was true.

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"Today not possible, Tomorrow possible" - Eternal Grand Master Lee

"Brace yourself, SOMETHING is going to break"

“	Originally Posted By: aqira motion is a dragon pearl however.... Does motion move Consider ...motion or what appears to be motion has only one direction. The mind may conceive other directions but what are they really Are they other directions or are they reference Motion is generated, it moves from the source of its generation on a path to its objective. This looks like motion because we see a comparison of over here and over there and we believe we can move from over here to over there. But do we Are objects really moved Relational reality changes through and by motion but does it really move	”

Wow, that's deep man. Must be good acid.

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