School Wrestling - Should Girls Compete?

On this thread Unkotare and I have been having an interesting discussion about whether or not Girls should be allowed to wrestle in Jr. High or High School.

So what do you think?

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"You remind me of a poem that I can't remember!" - Grandpa Simpson

It's all relative

Okay so now that I've answered the poll myself - here's why I think "No". Oh and if you answer the poll please say why you think that way - that's why it's public!

In Olympic sports there is a Men's and Women's version of each sport. Most sports are this way because well... men and women are different. Yes there are some women who are definitely better than men at many different sports - I know several women who could kick my trash in quite a few sports

I like the idea of having a girl's squad, but I doubt there is enough female interest in High School wrestling right now. Should girls learn how to wrestle? Yes - I think it would be very beneficial - probably more beneficial than many other MA disciplines in case of an attack.

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"You remind me of a poem that I can't remember!" - Grandpa Simpson

It's all relative

They already are in some places. I think people should be allowed to do whatever they want to do as long as it's within reason. Is a female is endangering herself then no but if she has shown she can compete and hang then why not?

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Rock On!
Cam
"Raise up your mind....."

I presume we are talking girls wrestling other girls; not like in some BJJ schools where you have mixed classes of no-gi (which truth be told I, at 49, am extremely uncomfortable with--although I have done it).

Getting back to the main point. In reality I think it is largely a budget problem. If you have budget and if you have female coaches and if you have interest and if the PTA does not have a fit (which they might in some parts of the USA)---then sure.

As a side note, here in Taiwan there is a fairly strong western boxing program in junior and senior high schools---for girls!

take care,
Brian

If it a public school, then the girls deserve equality in the right to participate. (And the boys in sewing class for that matter- referring to the thread this one came from.)

If people want to separate them, fine, but if there are not enough resources then the girls deserve the same opportunities as the boys. If that means being on the same team, so be it.

What else are you suggesting? That since the boys are uncomfortable, the girls just lose out? Too bad for them?

Warlordblade, you are a guy right? So, easy for you to say leave the girls behind. You wouldn't have been the one denied a learning opportunity.

Personally, I think it is high time people got over their issues of discomfort and just DEAL with it. The only way to do that is face it and get over it! Sometimes we are so hung up over goofy things. It reflects an immaturity in our society IMO.

What is there to be afraid of anyways?

One of the philosophies in my religious tradition given by the founder (Victor Anderson) is the idea of "leaning into discomfort." To do so gives one a great opportunity to grow, mature, and learn, becoming a better and stronger person in the process. I think that idea applies here.


-aaradia

p.s. Forgive the irritated tone of this post, but I really am a bit disgusted that in 21st century America there are still such questions as this being brought up.

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I must not fear.Fear is the mind-killer.Fear is the little death that brings total obliteration.I will face my fear.I will permit it to pass over me & through me.& when it has gone I will turn to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing.Only I will remain.F.Herbert

I do not have much knowledge of either US High Schools or wrestling but I would have thought the format has already been laid down by Judo which has been an Olympic sport for some time.

I think boys and girls should train together for competitions, separated only in competition by sex and weight categories.

I know it is taking it to an extreme of discrimination, but do you recommend that gays should train separately also, as I would think that would cause much "discomfort" in many "camps".

Excellent posts here - I appreciate the input! Unfortunately I am under time constraints at work here - the websense system is back up

So I'll try to respond a bit later - but I just wanted to say quickly to Aaradia

“	Originally Posted By: aaradia What else are you suggesting? That since the boys are uncomfortable, the girls just lose out? Too bad for them? Warlordblade, you are a guy right? So, easy for you to say leave the girls behind. You wouldn't have been the one denied a learning opportunity. ~~ p.s. Forgive the irritated tone of this post, but I really am a bit disgusted that in 21st century America there are still such questions as this being brought up.	”

I am a boy aaradia - and I am NOT saying to leave girls behind. No worries about your "irritated tone" as you say - I myself am frustrated that I can't seem to get out what I'm meaning. I'll try to give you more what I mean when I'm not under the watchful eye of Big Brother!

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"You remind me of a poem that I can't remember!" - Grandpa Simpson

It's all relative

OK i'm alright with girls being on the same team with guys but it's a fact that most guys are bigger & stronger than most girls. With that being said, should girls be allowed to wrestle with boys? I have mixed feelings on this. Wrestling is a team sport but at the same time it's up to the individual to win his weight class. This means a girl vs. boy situation. This could open the school up for a lawsuit if the girl gets injured while participating. Wrestling is a rough sport. Guys get hurt all the time when wrestling. Personally I wouldn't mind wrestling a girl. I'd gladly let a girl put me in a figure four lip lock....ooooppppps, I meant figure four leg lock.....lol. But seriously, no problems from me as long as the girl understood that the guy wasn't going to go easy on her because she was a girl.

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Mark
Liberalism is a mental disorder. -M. Savage

“	Originally Posted By: Jade_Dragon_03 OK i'm alright with girls being on the same team with guys but it's a fact that most guys are bigger & stronger than most girls.	”

I've met afew girls who could probably take me out... and technique is a big part of it too. on top of that, women are normally more flexible than men as well, which can make a huge difference in a sport like that.

But to get back in topic, while i do think that with the situation as it is, it creates an uncomfortable environment for both guy and girl, the girl should be allowed to wrestle, and it can teach some highly beneficial skills to them if they do.

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De Gustibus Non Carborundum

It should be allowed, because it hurts nothing.

FWIW, fifteen years ago, when I started wrestling, several teams had girls on the squad. None of them were starters, but they were on the team. Fifteen years later, I see no reason to regress.

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"You just sit right there and Doc will pour you a nice hot cup of suck it up!"

I've met loads if girls who could take me out!....To a movie, or a nice restaraunt!

Girls fighting?? It's just silly!!

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Faith itself, compelled by the Holy Spirit, possesses an inner dynamism that necessitates deeper understanding. ~Thomas Weinandy O.F.M.

I agree with what people have said about it being unfair to keep girls off the team just because guys are uncomfortable training with them. While I don't necessarily think they should compete against each other (though I'm not strongly against that either), I don't think there's anything wrong with men and women training together. I do lots of grappling classes (gi and no-gi), and yes, there are certain people that I feel kind of uncomfortable getting that physical with, but I accept that as part of training - I think if you're going to choose to participate in a contact sport, you shouldn't get choosy about who you work with just because it's a little awkward. There has been one case of a guy who's just full of degrading, sexual comments, so I just told the instructor I wouldn't work with him anymore (the instructor actually offered to kick him out of the class but I said it wasn't a problem as long as I never have to work with him).
As far as certain sports being deemed suitable only for males, I'm not even going to comment on that.

The poll results are clear.

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Wolfgang says:

I could think of a million better things to do in Japan for a month besides jumping off of picnic tables. - x893

I agree that the results are clear - but I do think my intent has been greatly misunderstood here.

I do think it's pretty funny that because this poll is open I am the only person who voted No - which really makes me look like a jerk. I am sorry if anybody was offended by this poll as that really wasn't my intention.

Also - I really hope that nobody on this thread has inferred that I think there are sports that are suitable for men and not women - as I don't feel that way at all.
Ok let me change that... I really don't think Sumo is suitable for women. Sorry. I don't think you can change my thinking on that EVER.
Anyway...

- Should girls learn wrestling moves? Yes - I have absolutely no problem with that. Definitely a beneficial skill for anybody to have.
- Should girls be allowed to train/compete with boys? I don't really have a problem with this either, since knowing these skills is most likely NOT going to be used in protecting themselves from another girl - usually men attack women and get into situations where wrestling skills would be useful.

My problem is with the question as stated in the poll. "Should Girls be allowed to wrestle with Boys in School sports?" This is where I do not think they should. NOT out of respect for boys comfort, or people being uncomfortable with boys and girls rolling around on a mat or anything like that.

My POV on this whole issue is that of a father.
As a father who may be having a girl in a few months (we'll find out in about a month - my wife really wants a girl!) - I've been thinking a lot about the differences between raising my boys and raising a girl. Should they be treated different? I think they should... because they ARE different.
My problem with girls wrestling boys in school sports is more because I worry about the safety and physical/emotional/mental health of my daughter. I don't think anybody should have to go through the hazing crap that happens in School sports these days, along with coaching and other sports politics.
Dojos, Kwoons, Clubs, etc where one can learn fighting arts, where people are there for that specific reason and not for popularity, or peer pressure, or whatever reason seems to be a more beneficial place for this type of training.
So yeah... I still probably didn't explain myself well but oh well... It's been interesting.

Thanks for contributing to this thread folks - it really has been interesting to see how everybody responds!

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"You remind me of a poem that I can't remember!" - Grandpa Simpson

It's all relative

Oh and FF... props on having the guts to answer that 3rd option...
YIKES!

__________________
"You remind me of a poem that I can't remember!" - Grandpa Simpson

It's all relative